water heater

[guitartom]

I removed what I believe is the panel outside for the water heater on/off switch that I've read here as having a cotter pin . I don't see it. I assume it's the first picture, which would be to the far right in the second photo.I'm attaching a few pictures, if anyone can offer an insight I would be grateful. BTW, My inverter is located on the bathroom enclosure, on the other side of the tub. It's pretty darned inconvienent but, the last picture is about a foot over from it. It is ,I think, another satellite TV feed. I don't intend to subscribe but does anyone know what the circular above the coax connector is?

[Al-n-Sue]

As for the water heater switch - yours appears to be completely different than mine so not sure where the switch is. On mine it is some what hidden behind some tubes, but is very obvious when you look around the tubes.

The round connector you refer to is a 12v plug - accepts a typical cigarette lighter plug that you'll find with most car chargers for phones, GPS units, and other 12v accessories. It is powered directly from the battery when no shorepower is available and through the inverter/converter when plugged in to shore power.

BTW, the plugs by the inverter are on newer models - my 2003 does not have it.
Alan

[mtnguy]

I think I can see the bottom of the 110 volt switch for the water heater in the 1st photo. On the bottom left, behind the gas line loop, to the left of the round plastic cover (110 volt element ??), I can see the bottom of the (maybe) 110 volt toggle switch.

[Digger]

The switch is in the lower left corner behind all those tubes and wires, you can almost see part of it in you're photo.

Ed

[Al-n-Sue]

On second look - I think I do see it - now that Digger and mtnguy's sharp eyes located it. For some reason the configuration didn't look right. But now I see it is the same as mine after all. They say the memory is the first thing to go.:o

[Bill]

The first photo shows the outside of the water heater. As others have stated, the switch for the electric heating element is in the lower left, and in this photo is hidden behind the various pipes.

The second photo shows the upper and lower access panels behind the refrigerator (the pair on the left), and the panel behind the water heater (the single panel on the right).

The third photo shows the indoor switch controlling the gas heating element for the water heater. It is completely independent of the electric switch in the first photo - don't confuse them.

The fourth photo shows the indicator and test light panel for the battery, and fresh and gray water levels. The refrig fan switch is also on this panel.

The fifth photo shows the aux cable TV outlet near the floor next to the bed, along with an aux 12-volt cig lighter outlet. As is true of the coax connector near the refrig, you can get a signal from the TM's rooftop-mounted batwing antenna through this connector, or a signal from the campground cable TV outlet if you are hooked up to it. Satellite TV is not involved unless you bought a satellite dish and satellite TV tuner box. This connector is an electrical copy of the connectors on the panel to the right of the refrigerator.

By the way, I don't think you have an inverter unless you installed one as an aftermarket item. I think you are referring to the factory-installed converter.

Bill

[guitartom]

Thanks for all the quick replies. There is no price that could be put on the quality of information and generosity of spirit that I have received from the members of this forum. I thank you all. I did find the on/off. It was on the back wall lower left, behind everything, of the compartment, next to the rubber re set buttons. I could see no place for a cotter pin to inhibit the on/off function, but I'm happy to have found it anyway. It was on off. However, no hot water on shore power. (haven't tried gas) Do these rubber re set buttons have anything to do with it? In the TM, there is the on/off and next to it is a red light marked re set. It,however, doesn't move. When I first turned it on, after making sure as best I could that the hot water heater had water, the light was on. Then it started going on and off. Now it's off. I have no hot water. Am I in hot water?

[Bill]

First, I wouldn't be concerned about the cotter pin. I never saw much use for it, and I "lost" mine almost immediately.

The two Rubber Reset Buttons, each about the size of a quarter and covered with a black rubber membrane, are there to turn off the heat if the thermostat fails, to avoid a steam explosion I guess. You can push each one with your thumb, and if it clicks, you've found something. But it is unusual to have one trip, and I would expect nothing more than a squishy feel as you push.

If you are plugged into shore power, and if you have confirmed that the water heater's circuit breaker is on (the breakers are in the brown panel outside the bathroom near the floor), and if you put water in the heater, and then you turn the electric switch on, you should have hot water in less than 10 minutes. If you don't, then the electric heating element has almost certainly burned out. There was a thread not long ago about how to replace it. Not hard or expensive. The SEARCH tool should bring it up.

As I mentioned earlier, the switch inside by the sink controls the gas part of the heater. When you turn the switch to ON, the red light will come on. This signifies that the unit is trying to light the gas flame (it has an automatic lighter). The light itself does not move, but the switch should rock up and down like any other switch. When the flame lights, the red light will go out. The auto-lighter will try a certain number of times to light the flame - I think three - and if it fails, I think the light will go out, so having the light go out is not definitive. Naturally, there has to be gas in the tanks, and the tanks have to be turned on. Does the stove light (with a match)? Many people, including me, feel that you should always light the stove before trying to light anything else. It clears the air out of the gas line.

If you don't get hot water on gas, then you have a different problem - different from the electric problem. Since the gas heater and the electric heater are not connected in any way, I think it is unlikely that both failed at the same time, but stranger things have happened.

Bill

[rumbleweed]

If the HW heater has not been run on gas for a while, it may take a few tries to light itl as you need to purge the lines. This also holds for the stove and the fridge. Suggest you make yourself a note on the shore power plug to check HW heater switch before plugging in as Bill mentioned. It takes about 5 secs to burn up the heating element if it is turned on without being full of water.

[rotor_wash]

Another way to tell if the 110V element is working is to turn on the fridge fan and then listen for the fan noise to slightly reduce as you turn on the hot water tank switch in the outside compartment. You must of course be on shore power and make sure you have completely filled the hot water heater by running a hot faucet until you get a steady flow. I would also say five seconds to element burn out is a bit on the long end.

[guitartom]

When the manual refers to the power switch under the sink, are they referring to the one one the outside of the cabinet, next to the red re set button? I looked inside the sink cabinet and found no other switch. Also, this re set button seems fixed on my tm. Is it supposed to have some sort of play,spring action?

Thanks

[Bill]

Tom -

Your question in post #11 (above) was originally in a thread about lack of hot water from the electric heating element, so I'm guessing you are having trouble with heating on electric (shore power). I've moved your question here, to keep it with the rest of the discussion about the water heater problem you are experiencing. It is easier to troubleshoot if continuity is maintained.

To answer your question, there is no switch inside the sink cabinet, UNLESS a previous owner installed one. It has happened, and it is actually not a bad idea. Did you buy this TM from another owner? If he did install a switch, it should be readily visible. To make a quick check, open the cabinet door under the sink, and find the water heater. It is the octagonal white foam "cylinder", about a foot across. Look back along the upper right edge of the heater - you will see a small sheet metal box with a white electrical cable coming out of it. The cable comes toward you - follow it. It originally ran, without interruption, into a cable bundle that disappears into the floor. If a previous owner installed a switch, it is somewhere in this length of cable.

Back to your question, and referring to the third photo in your first post above. The control panel on the outside front of the sink - the one labeled Water Heater - has two things on it. One is a rectangular red light labelled RESET. It is a light, not a button, and it does not push, pull, twirl, whistle, or play Dixie. It just sits there, and either lights up or doesn't light up. The other thing on the panel is a switch labelled ON. It rocks up and down. It controls the gas part of the water heater, and ONLY the gas part. It is NOT RELATED IN ANY WAY to the electric part of the heater, or the electric operation of the heater. If the electric element won't heat water for you, this panel is the wrong place to look for the problem.

Or am I misunderstanding your question? It's happened before ...

Bill

[guitartom]

Tom -

Your question in post #11 (above) was originally in a thread about lack of hot water from the electric heating element, so I'm guessing you are having trouble with heating on electric (shore power). I've moved your question here, to keep it with the rest of the discussion about the water heater problem you are experiencing. It is easier to troubleshoot if continuity is maintained.

To answer your question, there is no switch inside the sink cabinet, UNLESS a previous owner installed one. It has happened, and it is actually not a bad idea. Did you buy this TM from another owner? If he did install a switch, it should be readily visible. To make a quick check, open the cabinet door under the sink, and find the water heater. It is the octagonal white foam "cylinder", about a foot across. Look back along the upper right edge of the heater - you will see a small sheet metal box with a white electrical cable coming out of it. The cable comes toward you - follow it. It originally ran, without interruption, into a cable bundle that disappears into the floor. If a previous owner installed a switch, it is somewhere in this cable.

Back to your question, and referring to the third photo in your first post above. The control panel on the outside front of the sink - the one labeled Water Heater - has two things on it. One is a rectangular red light labelled RESET. It is a light, not a button, and it does not push, pull, twirl, whistle, or play Dixie. It just sits there, and either lights up or doesn't light up. The other thing on the panel is a switch labelled ON. It rocks up and down. It controls the gas part of the water heater, and the gas part only. It has NO RELATIONSHIP in any way to the electric part of the heater, or the electric operation of the heater. If the electric element won't heat water for you, this panel is the wrong place to look for the problem.

Or am I misunderstanding your question? It's happened before ...

Bill
Bill,

Thanks for the info. I did buy this used, and partially stripped. I have learned a lot more on this forum , asking questions, and reading other posts, than I could have gotten even with dealer lessons. I now have everything working except the norcold fridge in gas mode. I'm assuming now that the on/off switch in the outside compartment is to feed gas to both. I guess there's another feed for the stove as that seems to work regardless of the position of the on off switch. All systems work in shore power or 12v mode. I'm going through various posts as well as the norcold owners manual and the additional norcold manual I downloaded from here. Unfortunately, I have no second pair of hands to try to light it from the outside.

Thanks again

[Bill]

Ummm, no. All of the appliances are plumbed (gas and water) and wired independently. There are no common switches or plumbing until you reach all-inclusive trailer-wide levels. In particular, the switches on the water heater have no control over the electrical supply (or the gas supply) to the refrigerator. Building a TM is simpler than you think. Drop in a refrigerator, hook it up. Drop in a water heater, hook it up. Drop in a toilet, hook it up. Drop in a sink, hook it up. They are basically not interconnected.

Does this mean you are now getting hot water on shore power? Would like to hear the story - others can learn!

"Stripped" sounds like an interesting challenge. The membership here will be a great help. Collectively, we have hundreds of years of experience, and we can fix almost any problem. I would welcome PMs, too, as I always do.

Bill

[guitartom]

Ummm, no. All of the appliances are plumbed and wired (gas and water) independently. There are no common switches or plumbing. In particular, the switches on the water heater have no control over the electrical supply (or the gas supply), to the refrigerator. Building a TM is simpler than you think. Drop in a refrigerator, hook it up. Drop in a water heater, hook it up. Drop in a toilet, hook it up. Drop in a sink, hook it up. They are basically not interconnected.

"Stripped" sounds like an interesting challenge. The membership here will be a great help - collectively, we have hundreds of years of experience, and we can fix almost any problem. I would welcome PMs, too, as I always do.

Bill

Being totally ignorant has it's advantages. It forces you to look at everything. I just found out that I had the gas supply to the fridge turned off in the outside compartment. In all the instructions, when it says as a first step, turn on gas, I thought it meant from the tanks. I still see no reference to the valve itself. Anyway, the fridge is working, it started right up. I can't tell if the fridge fan is. There is no red light on the panel. I don't hear anything like a fan. Maybe a fuse?

[Wavery]

Being totally ignorant has it's advantages. It forces you to look at everything. I just found out that I had the gas supply to the fridge turned off in the outside compartment. In all the instructions, when it says as a first step, turn on gas, I thought it meant from the tanks. I still see no reference to the valve itself. Anyway, the fridge is working, it started right up. I can't tell if the fridge fan is. There is no red light on the panel. I don't hear anything like a fan. Maybe a fuse?

There is no fan inside the fridge. However, there is a small circulating fan in the rear compartment that helps with heat removal from the coils.

There is a switch in front of your sink to operate that fan (it says, "Refrig Fan"). It is only necessary to turn that fan on when it is hot outside or if you are running the fridge with the roofs down.

[rumbleweed]

The fridge fan is mounted to a hole on the floor of the TM in the lower outside fridge compartment. I have had mine stop a few times when small pieces of foam from the raw edge of the hole jam between the fan and the screen to keep out critters. Open the lower outside access panel and check to see if the fan turns freely by hand. Glad you found the shut off valve. I just leave mine always on.

[rotor_wash]

Here is a view of the water heater AC rocker from below. As a reminder to self, when I have the switch on to preheat the water, I leave the access door open. That way I don't inadvertently leave the switch on when I lower the sides. So far this step has prevented replacing the element (again) when attaching shore power and having an empty hot water tank.

[rumbleweed]

I would not recommend leaving the access door open as should you accidentally close the rear shell with the door open, it will damage the interior walls and mangle the access door beyond repair. ( Based on actual experience). I have a reminder tag attached to the shore power cord.

Bob

[rotor_wash]

The reminder tag is an excellent idea, but the access door works very well for me as it stands out like a sore thumb on my walk-around.