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Old 09-25-2010, 10:25 AM   #31
Brutus
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True enough Wayne. They should have done a recall, but why bother? This way, Norcold can save a few bucks building a faulty fridge, not recall it, then generate extra revenue out of warranty for both Norcold and Norcold service centers. Hope they're happy saving $0.03 building my fridge because I'll be buying a Dometic if I ever need a replacement.

I did the wire swap myself yesterday. It's a 15-minute job at most. The bottom line is once the resistance in the wire builds past the magic threshold, the Norcold N300 won't stay lit on propane after you release the button. If you're lucky, you had really crappy wires that failed inside the warranty period. For the rest of us, the resistance builds slower and thus the wires fail out of warranty. The faulty wires look thick, but in fact are actually thin 18ga wire with a lot of insulation around them. (The numbers on side don't lie.)

For those who need to do this swap themselves in the future, here's a loose guide:

1. Don't pay $8-12 (plus mucho shipping) for the 628119 kit. ...and especially don't take it to a dealer and pay roughly $120 to get it fixed. I took the two wires to a local electronics shop and paid $2.68 for two 14 gauge wires (each 12" long) and 4 insulated connectors (came in a box of 5). They even crimped the wires for me.

2. Print out the Norcold N300 Switch Wire Kit Part # 628119 instructions from the link:
http://members.cox.net/k4gaa/NorcoldN300Kit.pdf

3. EDIT. For access to the wires, there's a couple ways to go.
Easiest way comes from Commodor47. Quoting from his post below (also see his pic below), he reached the wires in question once the radio was removed. They can also be reached from outside, once you remove the upper refrigerator access door. Next, remove the panel (wooden) and insulation. Do this and you can skip to step #8.

Otherwise, continue with steps 4-7 to move fridge forward below.

4. Remove door (flathead screw in upper left).

5. Remove 3 screws on each side of opening. I took out some of the extra bolt-head jobs but I don't think it was necessary to remove fridge.

6. Carefully pry up the wood trim piece at bottom front of fridge. I couldn't remove the fridge without doing that. I used a large flathead screwdriver and it worked fine. I pulled out the staples that were left in the floor as well. Personally, I think the area looks better without the goofy trim piece, but I suppose it's there to keep dirt etc from getting underneath the fridge...

7. Lift fridge up and out about 5-6 inches. You'll see all 4 connections for the red and blue wires as shown in the instruction diagram. I have a picture of it but can't get it to upload even after resizing it down. You honestly shouldn't need my pic though. Incidently, I looked at the back of fridge to see if any connections were binding. Not an issue. The propane feed line has plenty of "give" to allow the fridge to go forward 6 inches without harm.

8. I noted where the 4 connections were and pulled the wires. Took them to the electronics store to get replacements. Went with 14ga as noted above.

9. Put the wires on the proper blades (firmly) and that's it.

I fired up the fridge on propane and it ran fine immediately!

EDIT. This has indeed helped quite a few other TM owners out there with a Norcold N300 built before 3/16/05. Give it a shot if you have one of these older Norcolds with the tell-tale "Can't-keep-fridge-running-on-propane" problem.
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Old 09-26-2010, 06:26 AM   #32
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Brutus,
You're right, it is inexcusable when manufacturers pass off their engineering defects to us as maintenance issues. There should have been a recall as soon as they knew there was a problem, and this design flaw should not have taken years to be fixed in the product line. However, my standard for TM repairs is that I'd would still rather do it myself if the repair would take me less time to do than it would to haul it to a dealer and then go pick it up again later.

Your post makes this possible. Thanks for posting the detailed instructions!
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Old 09-26-2010, 03:36 PM   #33
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This was pretty easy. Wanting to make sure this is the right solution, I just pulled the infamous blue and red wires, tested them for continuity with a meter, and put them back on. The refrigerator now works on propane. This puts me in the if-its-not-broken-don't-fix-it category, so for now, I'll carry a little wire and 4 ends, just in case.

Thanks!
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Old 09-28-2010, 08:10 PM   #34
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<lol> You're welcome Adventureman! And yes, I wouldn't hang my butt out there so far (by posting wrong info) if this wasn't the right solution for this particular problem. I had been researching this problem for weeks after I talked to the dealer and got his quote. Not wanting to pay the dealer $120 for something I'd only use a few times (i.e. dry camping without my Honda 2000 generator), I pieced together a number of threads from this very forum and found THE solution. $2.68 later (plus some gas money), it's fixed...
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Old 10-28-2010, 11:43 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshbw View Post
I just bought my TM and the Norcold lights with the indicator going moving to all green. As soon as I let the button go it goes out. I have tried holding the button for a couple minutes but soon as I let go it falls out of the green. The thermocouple must be fine cause the gauge is working or is there a separate one for gas control? Any ideas, thanks
I own a 2005 2619 with the Norcold N300 and had the same issue as quoted above. It seems my situation was not enough heat on the thermocouple. Reading the instructions in the Norcold manual they instruct you to set the temperature dial to 5 (full cold) which also causes the burner to burn hotter allowing the thermocouple to heat up faster/hotter and work properly. So far that has solved my gas starting problems. (NOTE: There is a very similar documented issue (possibly the same issue) on the Norcold N300 due to bad wiring see "Norcold known issue" note and reference to the excellent post by Brutus at the end of this post.)

So during the troubleshooting phase to find a way to reliably start my refrigerator in LP gas mode I also came up with a procedure for starting it using tips I read on this site and others and instructions in the manual. I have organized these TIPS here in ONE LOCATION that may be useful for others as it has been for me and welcome others to modify this document as they see fit.

TIPS FOR STARTING AN LP GAS REFRIGERATOR:

(Before starting make sure LP gas is ON and you have purged air from gas lines as much as possible - See "PURGING AIR" below)

1) Turn the MODE knob to OFF then back to GAS, making sure the mode switch is positioned on GAS as it should be.

2) Turn the fridge TEMP control FULL COLD to 5 on the dial as per the manual. On 5 it provides more gas to the burner and thermocouple to more quickly heat up the thermocouple enough and allowing the fridge to remain lit. This is what ultimately solved my issue.

3) After the red needle reaches full GREEN (stops moving to the right) I continue to hold right red button for 30 to 40 seconds before releasing it.

Sometimes it takes a few times, but usually by the 3rd time it's lit and good to go. I think some thermocouples are positioned or calibrated differently from unit to unit because some fridges start first time every time and other's take a time or two apparently to get the thermocouple hot enough. And some of these Norcold N300s have flakey wiring, the FIX is posted by Brutus in this thread.

CAUTION: According to the Norcold N300 manual there is a certain amount of time they recommend between re-attempting to light the fridge. This warning should be read and understood and override any advice in this document.

PURGING AIR: Wayne's advice of waiting 30 to 60, even 100 seconds while holding the red button down BEFORE clicking the starter make sense, it takes that much time for gas to get to the refrigerator when LP valve is first turned on after sitting. (Please see his full post about his on page 1 of this thread). I also light the furnace after I light my stove burners, letting it warm up a bit feels long enough to help purge gas lines of air.

Also as posted by Digger in this thread, he received good information from factory folks that on his TM there is a 'T' where source gas is split into two lines feeding each side of the RV. One line for the stove/furnace and the other for the water heater/refrigerator. Therefore it's extremely helpful to also start the Water Heater using gas BEFORE trying to light the refrigerator because they both use the same gas supply line. Sucessfully starting the water heater will help ensure the line is gas filled plus the water heater is normally easier to light. Again, because they use the same gas line this will help purge air from the fridge's gas line which should make it easier to light.


PREVENTATIVE OPERATION: I run my fridge on gas while parked at home periodically to allow the burner to heat up to remove dust or very small insects and such along with visual inspection and cleaning as needed making sure it works properly the next time gas mode is needed. Even when staying at a park with full hookups a lengthily power outage can make gas mode a nice feature to have working.

Norcold N300 Known Issue: For those with the Norcold N300 units who can initially start their unit in gas mode but once the red button is released the red needle on the status meter moves back to white, indicating the unit is no longer lit and cannot start their units after multiple attempts, should read the excellent post by Brutus in this same thread which seems to directly address and FIX this issue.
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Old 01-26-2011, 04:20 PM   #36
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I don't know how I missed the last part of this thread (Must have been camping). I sure regret it tho......excellent thread.

As soon as I get rid of this darn cold, I'm going down to replace those wires.
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Old 01-26-2011, 05:49 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by harveyrv View Post
I don't know how I missed the last part of this thread (Must have been camping). I sure regret it tho......excellent thread.

As soon as I get rid of this darn cold, I'm going down to replace those wires.
You're welcome Wayne and thanks for the kind words. If you bought the $20ish kit, I'd say send it back. If not, glad I caught you in time (so you could just buy a couple feet of wire). Either way, it should only cost you a few bucks to fix this problem. Let me know if you have any questions.
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Old 01-26-2011, 06:32 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
You're welcome Wayne and thanks for the kind words. If you bought the $20ish kit, I'd say send it back. If not, glad I caught you in time (so you could just buy a couple feet of wire). Either way, it should only cost you a few bucks to fix this problem. Let me know if you have any questions.
r/Pat
I have all the 12 and 14G marine wire that a guy would need to re-wire a boat. I also have hundreds of heat-shrink crimp connectors.

Some people mentioned reaching those wire by removing the radio. Is it easier to just pull the fridge out a bit?
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Old 01-26-2011, 07:05 PM   #39
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I was able to reach the wires in question once the radio was removed. They can also be reached from outside, once you remove the upper refrigerator access door. Next, remove the panel (wooden) and insulation. The attached thumbnail was taken with the radio removed and the outside, upper access panel and insulation removed.

Dick
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Old 01-26-2011, 07:25 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by commodor47 View Post
I was able to reach the wires in question once the radio was removed. They can also be reached from outside, once you remove the upper refrigerator access door. Next, remove the panel (wooden) and insulation. The attached thumbnail was taken with the radio removed and the outside, upper access panel and insulation removed.

Dick
Great pic.....thanks for that.
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