Trying to plug into shore power, popping house GFI

Hi Everyone.

Newbie question. We're trying to get the TM ready to go and plugged into the house. Our (house) GFI pops several time and appears to have popped a circuit breaker on the panel (can't get the garage lights to come back on)

a) checked all of the TM circuit breakers including the one at the battery

b) yes, the bathroom wall is up (for any super newbie, we lost 1/2 of a Saturday because our lights wouldn't light because I hadn't fully assembled the bathroom and there is a safety switch in there (clever!))

c) battery is almost dead, DH said he heard the exhaust from the refridge going one night?)

d) we have a plug converter that allows us to "plug the plug" but does it need to convert from 20 to 30? (please don't laugh, I know nothing about power).

e) we know the house receptalce works b/c I'm plugging a toaster into it.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated

[mjlaupp]

Most likely suspect: You have or have had the 110vac electric water heater switch on (located in the outside water heater compartment) and an empty water heater while plugged into shore power. This blows the electric water heater element in less than 30 seconds. The way to check for this is to disconnect both leads on the heater element and try again. Note that this will not be covered under warranty unless you can prove the dealer did the foul deed.

Your 20 to 30 amp converter plug should not be the problem unless you are trying to run the air conditioner. The A/C requires a 30 amp circuit to function properly.

Mike

Try turning off all the circuit breakers in the TM. Reset the GFI and breaker in the house. Now plug in TM. Check to see if it tripped the GFI. If not turn one circuit breaker at a time on in the TM to determine which one trips the GFI. Your manual will then tell you what devices are hooked to the breaker. Remember once you find and fix the fault you will still be limited to what you can run when connected to a garage outlet. The type of connector 20A vs 30A has nothing to do with your problem here.

[ShrimpBurrito]

The above suggestions are good. I had a very similar problem, except my house GFI would trip when I plugged my TM into the outlet, even with all the TM circuit breakers off.

This thread might have some useful info:
http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ead.php?t=8067

Note that my problem had nothing to do with washing the TM; it was a mere coincidence. The cause was frayed insulation on my A/C, but my A/C is side mount, whereas yours is on the roof.

Dave

First, let me start by saying THANK YOU so I dont forget.

We did the circuit breaker check outlined by Bob above. Tripped the house GFI when we got to Fridge, Wtr Heater, Convert. So that makes me think it's the water heater as Mike suspected. So the next question is, we're trying to push the reset buttons but there doesn't seem to be a switch inside (no obvious on/off). Does that mean they didn't trip and we're hosed?

Also, question from the DH -- so we don't leave that turned on all the time? He thought turning the interior switch on the control panel turned it off. Wrong assumption?

THANK YOU for all of your advise. Laptop definintely coming with us on the big trip.

[ZekenSpider]

Asumming you have a Suburban Model SW6DE Water Heater (WH), as viewed from the outside of the TM, the water heater 120 volt switch is partially hidden in the lower LH corner. It is to the left of the oval end black cover (not the rectangular black cover near the top) and behind a 1/4" gas line.

If this switch is on, it will cause the WH 120 volt heating element to burn out almost immediately(if there is no water in the WH) when the shore power is applied. The switch should have a small cotter key through it to prevent accidental turn on.

Once the element is burned out it causes the WH 120 Volt circuit neutral to contact ground (through the water) and causes the shore power GFI to trip. The WH 120 volt circuit hot is also grounded through the water but often has enough resistance that the WH breaker does not trip.

As Mike at mjlaupp says: Most likely suspect: You have or have had the 110vac electric water heater switch on (located in the outside water heater compartment) and an empty water heater while plugged into shore power. This blows the electric water heater element in less than 30 seconds. The way to check for this is to disconnect both leads on the heater element and try again. Note that this will not be covered under warranty unless you can prove the dealer did the foul deed.

To disconnect both leads from the heater element, FIRST disconnect shore power, then remove the oval shaped black cover. The element will be exposed and have two screw terminals. Disconnect both and tape each of the wires. Reconnect shore power to test. If that solves the GFI trip, leave it as is until the element can be replaced. The black cover can be replaced as long as the wire ends are carefully taped.

Replacing the element is not too difficult but does require a good set of tools. Disconnect shore power, turn off the propane and drain the WH.

Jerry

[Bill]

The answer is probably here
http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ead.php?t=8101
but it is pretty dry and technical. It takes a few pages of text to say what Mike said - your water heater's electric heating element has probably burned out.

The water heater can run on either gas or electricity (or both). The switch on the front apron of the kitchen sink controls the gas part of the water heater. The electric part is controlled by a separate switch, which (handily enough) has to be accessed from outside the TM. The switch is pointed out by the arrow in the picture that is part of the tutorial found here
http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ead.php?t=2457

As ZekenSpider said, it is not hard to replace the element. A new one costs about $10 at any RV place - just tell them you have a Suburban SW6DE water heater. You will need a special water heater element wrench, shown below, which you can get for about $5 in the plumbing section at Home Depot / Lowes, or many hardware stores. It looks like a silver steel cylinder, about 5 inches long and 1 1/2 inches in diameter.

Bill

[ShrimpBurrito]

Originally Posted by Bill

The electric part is controlled by a separate switch, which (handily enough) has to be accessed from outside the TM.

That is retarded. Why on earth didn't Suburban wire it for a switch on the inside? I presume the current design is nothing fancy -- a switch in series with the heating element, and thus, it can't be far from the heater due to the current draw. But a relay would be a very cheap and simple solution to that problem.

Of course, if they did that, they wouldn't sell as many heater elements.

Dave

You guys are awesome. Truly. Many thanks for your words of advice. I'm going to print this thread and go out see if I can make it work. I also like the suggestion to buy a spare element for the tool box in case this ever happens again.

Now if only we could figure out how to get the garage power back on!

One other questions (sorry!). Any clue why DH would have heard an exhaust fan going when the trailer was completely down? He thinks it was around the refridgerator area and we thought everything was off.

I'm still reading through all the forum threads but I wishing there was a big red "turn everything off" button. We've completely drained the battery and have no idea why as we thought everything was off. Did leaving the water heater on do that? Shouldn't the short have killed power to the WH?

Have sent the 12 volt link to DH to read. May try to tackle it myself after my morning coffee.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.