Replace Thetford w/Sealand 711-M28C?

The factory toilet vents right into the trailer. I think anything would be an improvement. Another reason I want to dump the thing. Choosing the best venting would be a good discussion. Maybe a hose that is attached to the roof arm and extends to the top of the roof may be a possibility. Robert

[thewayneo]

Originally Posted by ShrimpBurrito

This brings up a good point.

Wayne -- did you talk with Sealand at all about venting through the floor, or did you do that on your own?

Dave

This was the method suggested by the distributor/installer "ARDEMCO". They equated the TM with installations in boats. I quizzed him about gases, smells, etc. and he thought it was a non-issue. I'm with the simplest way first!

[ShrimpBurrito]

Originally Posted by thewayneo

This was the method suggested by the distributor/installer "ARDEMCO". They equated the TM with installations in boats. I quizzed him about gases, smells, etc. and he thought it was a non-issue. I'm with the simplest way first!

Excellent, although I always thought black tank vents on boats were above the water line, and thus above the tank. Maybe he knows of others mounted below. I didn't know if the gasses in particular would be an issue (sewage emits flammable gasses). I wouldn't expect smells to be a problem since the Thetford is vented to the TM interior. Looking forward to hearing your report from your 1st trip with the mod.

Dave

[ELM-JLM]

I found this in the instalation instructions!

3. Run 5/8" (16mm) I.D. hose to vent fitting and secure
with hose clamps.
Install thru-hull vent fitting:
(not supplied with unit – SeaLand part number 346368)
4. Drill hole through the hull, well above water line
and directly above SeaLand toilet. Hole location is
determined by routing and length of hose.

Per the instalation instructions, I would think a small hole through the wall and a removable hose attachment from the outside would take the vent to the roof!

[Bill]

Wayne -

As I read this thread, and your tutorial, a question came to mind. The Sealand manual says that on average, the toilet uses about a quart of fresh water each time you flush it. The more you flush it, the more fresh water you use. This might put off anyone who boondocks a lot, and has to carry potable water in jugs. But there is really no reason to use potable water to flush a toilet.

Based on your experience with the toilet, would it be possible to flush it by pouring a half bucket of non-potable water from a nearby stream or pond into the bowl while you hold the pedal down? Or even a half bucket of gray water from your own tank? By doing so, you wouldn't deplete your potable water supply.

How much water does it take to flush decently? How much is a "half bucket"? Have you had a chance to try it?

The rinse might not be quite as good as it is using pumped water, but I would think that a bit of practice should overcome that.

A "half bucket" might be more water than the toilet normally uses. But the 9-gallon holding tank capacity, as opposed to the Thetford's nominal 3-gallon usable capacity, would help that situation.

Just a thought. If this works out, TM might consider changing over.

Bill

[yoda911]

Originally Posted by Bill

Wayne -

Based on your experience with the toilet, would it be possible to flush it by pouring a half bucket of non-potable water from a nearby stream or pond into the bowl while you hold the pedal down? Or even a half bucket of gray water from your own tank? By doing so, you wouldn't deplete your potable water supply.

Bill

This has been an interesting thread to follow and I am indeed considering it. Along the same line that Bill mentioned, would it be possible to add a valve with a feed line into the grey water tank and a small pump, using grey water to flush? This way you would switch the valve to fresh water when starting out, until there is enough grey water then switch to grey water to limit the fresh water use. When sailing, we never use fresh water to flush, it is always drawn from the ocean. Hopefully the TM is not surrounded with sea water but it does have a grey water supply.
Just thinking outside the box.

Cliff

[thewayneo]

I hadn't ever thought about using a bucket to flush. I've always had “normal” toilets in my RV's and I always boondock. I always put a deck plate in my water tanks so it's easy to add the extra jug of water if needed. The Sealand manual says:

Average water consumption per flush 1 Qt. (.95 L)
Minimum water consumption per flush 1 Pt. (.47L).

It's real easy (if you're quick-of-foot) to use the minimum amount of water to completely evacuate liquids. The bowl is cone shaped. To test this I put one pint of water into the toilet bowl and unscientifically measured the depth at 1-1/4”. Then I gave a quick kick and measured the depth of water (that amazingly and automatically remains in the bowl!) at 1”. So I think the Sealand minimum per flush is pretty close.

Another consideration is that when we boondock we're usually out in the woods all day, and naturally doing as the bears out there do. I guess that's part of why toilet water consumption isn't something I paid much attention to.

So one answer to the bucket question would be yes, you could add a pint of water for liquid, or a quart for other. I looked at the bucket I use to wash my car and it holds over two gallons. Of course, you would have to install a shut off valve to prevent your fresh water from going into the bowl when you depress the flush pedal. Maybe that option should be added to the tech library article? http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...5575#post95575

As a side note, I like the sanitary aspect of foot flush.

I gotta say I'm really happy with this toilet.

I considered the grey water flush idea but it just seems like more trouble than it's worth to me. I do think somebody else should try to perfect it though! Here's what I looked at a while back:
http://www.modmyrv.com/2009/07/22/rv...er-potty-flush

wayne

Originally Posted by yoda911

This has been an interesting thread to follow and I am indeed considering it. Along the same line that Bill mentioned, would it be possible to add a valve with a feed line into the grey water tank and a small pump, using grey water to flush? This way you would switch the valve to fresh water when starting out, until there is enough grey water then switch to grey water to limit the fresh water use. When sailing, we never use fresh water to flush, it is always drawn from the ocean. Hopefully the TM is not surrounded with sea water but it does have a grey water supply.
Just thinking outside the box.

Cliff

Maybe shower water, but our kitchen sink grey water is pretty stinky (I like garlic), and there's always some small solids in it. Your grey water pump and valves would have to be able to handle that, or maybe a filter of some sort ...

Another advantage of using the grey water is that it frees up some space in the grey water tank.

When boondocking in FS campgrounds out west, you often have water nearby, even if they are hand pumps, but no dump stations, even for grey water. And we generate a lot more grey water than black water.

Almost finished installing Sealand toilet in my 2720SL TM. The toilet needed framing to raise it two inches from floor so bottom of toilet would clear wheel well. Used a two by four on edge to space framing from back of wall. Also had to cut into wood brace a little that supports outside wall of vanity because the framing wasn't high enough to completely clear support. I didn't want to raise toilet more than two inches. If I can figure out how to post pictures I will. Have many of the framing process. Also hade to cut out hole for drain about 1 and 1/4 inches foward(toward vanity).

I still have to add water supply and vent. Hard part is over, IT FITS! It was a fair amount of work. Robert