Grounding Problems

My wife and I have a 2005 Trailmanor 2720SD and are currently spending the Christmas-New Years holidays at Olema Ranch Campground in northern california by the coast. We have had LOTS of rain over the past few days and noticed that my dogs would yelp when entering the Trailmanor from outside with their paws wet. I did not understand why until I got a small shock when touching the door knob myself with wet shoes on. I contacted the maintenace person for the campground who came over the check things out. I assumed that the 20 Amp outlet was wired incorrectly. After checking the ground and wiring, the maintanence person showed me that the plug was wired correctly using his outlet tester. He used the tester on the outlet on the outside of the trailmanor, and the tester showed that the neutral and hot wires were reversed. I took the tester inside and checked the outlet for the TV which showed that there was an open ground. Two different problems with two different outlets....however the campground outlet tested fine. Has anyone else experienced a problem such as this?

Thank you,
Steve

[Bill]

Yow! I cannot imagine how anything got this mucked up. Unfortunately, it is not a problem you should ignore. Some thoughts.

1. I assume you do not have electrician skills. The problem you are seeing is not something that an average handyman without electrician skills should tackle.

2. Do you have an outlet tester like the one the campground guy used? If not, you should probably get one (I personally feel that EVERYONE should have one, and leave it permanently plugged in to the outlet by the refrig.) They are cheap - anywhere from $3 to $10, and any hardware store will have one.

3. Do you have a digital voltmeter? If not, you might want to get an inexpensive one from Radio Shack, Home Depot, Lowes, ACE Hardware, etc. About $15.

4. My first step would be to plug the TM into the power outlet at a different post, and see if the problem persists. Will your cord reach? Even a three-wire extension cord will do, since this is a quick test. First check the outlet at the other post with your new 3-light tester. If it tests good, plug in your TM and repeat the tests you described above.

5. If the problem persists when plugged into a different post, my personal preference would be to get to a different campground (or home) and repeat the tests. HOWEVER, these zings you describe are nothing to be trifled with, since the current path from your hand to your feet crosses through your HEART! Do not absorb any more zings! T'ain't good for the dogs, either.

6. The front end of your TM is supported by what? In other words, what does the lower end of the jack stem rest on? As a quick and dirty, you might try removing the wood block, rubber wheel, plastic box or whatever, and driving the lower end of the jack stem right down into the mud. This will at least ground the trailer frame, which should eliminate the zings. Problem is, you don't know if the zings are gone without testing it - and I really recommend that you DON'T test it on yourself. This is where the voltmeter would help you determine if there is any residual voltage between the frame and ground.

Note that if there is a wiring error within the TM, NONE OF THE ABOVE will correct it. You really need the services of an electrician, probably at an RV place. If he finds an error, have him document it, and I would bet that TM will stand good for the cost since your TM is still new.

Bill

Bill,

Thanks for your very detailed response! I do have some electrical skills, however what is strange is that it appears there are two different wiring problems. If it were just a matter of reversing the hot and neutral, I would do that, however with a second problem (open ground) at a different outlet, who knows what all is messed up. I will recheck it with either a DVM or tester when I get home and hook up. Our unit is less then a year old and I am taking it into the dealer this next weekend for 2-3 weeks, having them repair some other minor warranty issues we have postponed having completed until winter set in and spring/summer camping was over. I will just have this added to their "to do" list.

We did run a large gauge copper ground wire from one of the TM jacks to a metal water pipe (earth ground)....This seems to have helped somewhat, however it has not eliminated the problem completely. The current present is not high, however I just open the door with a towel or something and carry the dogs in and out...I am sure it is more uncomfortable to them, then to me.

Otherwise we are hunkered down for the next couple days with our wireless internet service and Dish Network television, along with a microwave and left overs from Christmas dinner, having a good ole time.

Steve

[Speckul8r]

YOW and HOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can't agree more with Bill. This is nothing to be mucking around with. Obviously, the reversed receptacle needs to be "unreversed". Unplug the trailer and do it as soon as it stops raining. Don't want to be playing with that stuff in the rain. The next thing is to tackle that ground. If you don't see anything amiss in the receptacle box, I've found several wires loose in the access panel behind the fridge. That's where I would do a good visual and even a SLIGHT tug of the wires in the wire nut connections. I thought I saw a wiring schematic in my owners manual. If it's not there, there aren't that many outlets in the rig so I'd check the ground on the rest of the outlets with the meter or the light tester. Assuming they all check out fine, pull out the nearest receptacle and see if the grounds are all good and tight. Working your way to the last one. I think I'd do that anyway because where there is 1 problem there is probably 2. The receptacles are split into different circuits but I'd stilll want to check them all for myself. If the problem ground is on the last receptacle of the run then the solution has to be between there and the previous outlet. Assuming no other grounding goofs. You know that it's the last one in line because only 1 set of wires are in the box.

Good Luck and don't procrastinate!!

Hi and thanks all for your helpful comments.

Change of plans... 4am on Dec. 31st we were evacuated from the campground due to flooding from the rising creek and after the rains subsided and the water level receeded, we retrieved our TM out of approx. 3-6 inches of mud on New Years Day. We were lucky in that our TM was parked high and dry on an elevated site (unbeknownst to us at the time we reserved this particular site) and nothing got wet inside... WHEWWWWW!! It was a beautiful sight to say the least, seeing our TM still sitting there like a becon in the night when we returned to the campground at 6:30am Jan. 1st... one of the few left standing there... most everyone else had towed their rigs out during the evacuation and I saw several that were being towed through 3 feet or more of water and surely had gotten wet inside. I'm sure our TM would have gotten wet had we done that but we were in such a hurry to get out of there we reluctantly opted to leave our TM behind. Lowering and towing it out would have required us to tow it through deep water which our Jeep barely cleared.

The TM is going into the dealership on Friday (prescheduled minor warranty work) so the electrical problem will be added to the to-do list. Will post a followup afterwards.

Hope all had a Happy New Year!
-Brigitte

Photos attached... 1- Site 218 before flood on Thanksgiving. 2- Site 218 morning after flood on New Years Day. 3- Olema Creek 35 yds from Site 218.

[Speckul8r]

GOOD GRIEF!!!!!!!!!! That could have gotten real ugly real fast! Glad all is well

I have a 2006 3023 and had a similar problem when my interior wall socket under the couch on the curb side developed an open ground. In my case, it was not a shocking experience as was yours but in trying to trouble shoot it I found that the electrical circuit ran to the exterior plug on the curb side and then to the faulty interior wall socket.

Depending on which interior socket you checked it "MAY" be possible that your problems are related. It has been a long time since I took my EE courses but it may be that the outlet with the wires reversed causes the downstream hotwire to see ground and gives you an open ground indication.

I only provide this info incase the RV dealer only finds "one" problem. He may not be incorrect.
Bill

Originally Posted by BrigCA61

The TM is going into the dealership on Friday (prescheduled minor warranty work) so the electrical problem will be added to the to-do list. Will post a followup afterwards.

-Brigitte

Follow-up:

Greg at Dinuba RV checked complete electrical system and found nothing wrong. He explained to me how this was probably the hookup outlet shorting out in the rain because the box was not sealed. He mentioned sometimes in this condition the outlet may check good but still be bad. He told me not only to test but to physically look at the outlet and make sure there is no dark (burnt) discoloration in the outlet and if there is then move on to another site. Also to check the prongs on the trailer plug and if they look discolored or burnt then there is an issue with the hookup. Don’t rely solely on the tester.


Click on the link below to see the a detailed post-service report in the "Dealers and Deals Made" category.

http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ead.php?t=3713

[B_and_D]

We just stayed at Olema Ranch Campground for three nights and also had a weird electrical problem. We didn't get shocked or anything, but they had just been flooded (again) two weekends ago. When it was time to leave, I turned on the water pump to wash our hands in the TM sink after we disconnected, but nothing would work. I checked the 12V inline fuse, and it looked OK. I also checked the batteries with my digital voltmeter, and it didn't register anything. It seemed as though the batteries were completely drained. I know that they were fully charged when we left, and left in the fuse during our stay. It seemed weird that our 2-year old 6-volt Trojans would just die like that. I cleaned off all the connections, etc, but nothing helped. Both batteries were full of water.

After poking around some yesterday, it turns out that the batteries were charged, but the inline 12v fuse (although the filament was intact) was the problem. There was some brown discoloration inside the glass. What's weird is that my digital voltmeter (as I found after I took it apart) at this very point in time decided to sever the positive wire connection in the center of the plug (it is the plug-in type). The design is such that the contact point at the end flexes in and out and causes wear to the sodered joint, eventually ending in up in a severed connection. I sodered it back, put in a new 12v fuse, and now everything is wonderful. I'm going to buy another voltmeter to take along as a backup.