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Attention you TM experts; I am in the market for a used TM.Since there are several models and varying lengths/weights I need your opinon on the proper to buy for my tow vehicle. I have a 2005 Ford Explorer Sport Trac V6 with a 4.0 engine 2wd.The plate on the drivers side post tell me I have a GVWR 5840 with a front GAWR 2900 and a rear GAWR 3200.Would an oil and transmission cooler be necessary to pull a larger model.I live along the front range in Colorado and would pull the trailer in the mountains at times over steep passes.

Hello experts,more data on my tv.Will this make a difference in towing capacity? The truck has a 4.0L SOHC FFV V6 engine.the wheel base is 126.0inchs,and is equipped with on-the-fly 2wd/4wd/low 4wd.

What sayth you now my hardy fellows.

[RockyMtnRay]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

Attention you TM experts; I am in the market for a used TM.Since there are several models and varying lengths/weights I need your opinon on the proper to buy for my tow vehicle. I have a 2005 Ford Explorer Sport Trac V6 with a 4.0 engine 2wd.The plate on the drivers side post tell me I have a GVWR 5840 with a front GAWR 2900 and a rear GAWR 3200.Would an oil and transmission cooler be necessary to pull a larger model.I live along the front range in Colorado and would pull the trailer in the mountains at times over steep passes.

Thank you all in advance.....Archy

A transmission cooler will be necessary to pull even the smallest TM model over the Colorado mountains.

Towing any TM with 4 liter V6 over Colorado's mountains is a way less than pleasant experience. I know...I tried to tow a 2720SL for 2 years with a 4L Jeep. You'll be down to about 25~45 mph on every long climb...and watching your engine temp climb the entire time. You simply do not have either the torque or the wheelbase to satisfactorily or safely tow anything larger than a 2619 or maybe a 2720. Don't even think about trying a 3023 or larger.

After the 2nd unhappy year of towing, I traded my Jeep for a 4.7L V8 Toyota Tundra (325 ft-lbs torque with 3.92 axle stock). Even that was barely enough power to stay with traffic on the climbs. After about $4000 worth of performance modifications (see my signature), I've now got a truck that will quite nicely pull my 2720SL over any pass in the state.

If you're content with crawling over the passes at 25 to 35 mph with the engine at 4000 RPM in 1st or 2nd gear, your Explorer will be adequate for a 2720 or smaller. Don't even think about anything larger/heavier.

Well, maybe the original answers are confusing because you do indeed have 126" wheelbase (according to my research) which is not too short a wheelbase after all. You also have 5300lbs tow rating (without additional oil coolers) and a GCWR of 9600 which also is not so bad. Certainly, the TM site will suggest that you can tow any of the models.

However, the magic words were "live in Colorado", "pull in the mountains" and "pull over steep passes". ....and you have a V6 with 245lbs ft. of torque. For first-hand knowledge of how this kind of combination might work in practice, you won't find a better source than Ray.

If you take into account the longer wheelbase figure, I don't think Ray's reply would read much differently. If you have the optional "heavy-towing" 4.10 rear axle, though (3.73 is standard), perhaps Ray would modify his answer to say your level of discomfort in the passes would be a bit less.

-Paul

[Bill]

Apparently the 2005 Sport Trac came in three different wheelbases - 101.7 for the two door version, 111.5 for the 4-door version, and 125.9 for the Crew Cab version. So that is some of the confusion, since we don't know which you haved, archy.

More confusion comes from the assertion in the original post that the truck in question is 2wd as well as 4 wd. That makes about 220 pounds of difference in towing capacity, which isn't crippling, but it is some. Either way, it appears to be in the area of 5000 pounds "when properly equipped". As Ray has pointed out, this puts it in the realm of the possible, but not generous, for the towing you have in mind.

I haven't yet found out what "properly equipped" means, except that it MUST have a WDH. One reference says it must have a "factory towing package" to reach this capacity, but doesn't define what is in the package.

The Ford web site is hard to navigate, but is often quite helpful with this stuff. In this case, it is a nearly ocmplete washout. I'll keep looking.

Bill

You folks have me concerned again. I'm a prospective TM buyer, with a leased 2006 Jeep Liberty with almost three years left on the lease. It has a factory installed class III trailer package. GCWR is 10,150 (curb weight 4,033), max trailer weight 5,000, tongue load limit 750, but a wheelbase of 104. It has a 3.7L 6-cyl gas engine and an automatic transmission. We expect to use a TM to take our sea kayaks (on the Jeep's roof) mostly to Maryland's eastern shore, which is essentially flat. However, we live in Pennsylvania's Poconos. By Rocky Mountain standards the Poconos are bumps in the road. Out here we call them mountains anyway. Home is at 1,300 feet (see, bumps), but we have to climb to that over a relatively short drive. We may also want to take the TM and the kayaks to New York's Adirondacks or up to Maine.

We looked at a 2720 and a 3124 last week. The queen bed in the 2720 is kind of turning us against that. We're old enough to no longer sleep through the night, and one of us would have to climb over the other to get to the bathroom. The 3124's king bed would allow us to sleep in line with the hall, so we'd be less disruptive of each other. Naturally, the TM dealer told us that "whatever we're driving will pull whatever he's selling" and the Jeep would be fine with a 3124.

Not to impune the dealer's honesty, but you folks seem to bring out facts the dealer didn't. If we stay out of the Rockies will we enjoy towing a 3124 with a Jeep Liberty, or should we not buy a TM now and get a real tow vehicle three years from now and keep sleeping at the Hilton until then?

Leon,

The early 2 -door SUVs were 101.7" wheelbase, while the 2005 sport trac pickup shows as 125.9". The 2007 sport trac has 130" wheelbase.
No need to apologize. With SUVs, pickups, different years, short cabs long cabs, extended, cabs, short beds, regular beds, long beds, etc, etc., the same model can have many wheelbase specs- it's really confusing.

-Paul

[rpcoombs]

I used to sell TM's for Chesapeake Rv Solutions in Virginia (just to keep busy as a retired naval officer- didn't need the money and would not give anyone bad advice) and believe me you would never get a bad answer from me/them. (I'm a fourth generation conservative '64 graduate Bates College of Lewiston, Maine (1 0f 20 out of thousands in the last 100 years)). Your combination sounds fine for anywhere on the east coast. Trust me -- I used to work for the government and I'm here to help you!! Call Tim Loen at "Chesapeake RV Solutions "(google his web site) and he (having nothing to do with you purchase -- # 2 dealer in the country) will confirm you'll be OK

[commodor47]

TakingTerns,

Let me allay some of your fears regarding towing a TM with the Jeep Liberty. We spent the last two winters (Jan, Feb, Mar) in southwest AZ, CA, GA, FL, SC, and NC. Our 2004 Jeep Liberty Sport did just fine. From our home we traveled I-84, I-81, I-40, I-20, I-10 to reach the Tucson area. The trip back to the east coast was a little easier as we stayed on I-10 one year and drove I-20 to the Atlanta area last year. If you are interested, we had a travel Web site for our 2005 trip and it is still open for viewing.

http://mytripjournal.com/trailmanoradventure2004-2005

When deciding which TM you can safely tow don't forget to check the manufacturers recommended trailer length. I believe the Jeep Liberty has TT length limit somewhere around 20 feet. That would put you over the limit if towing the 3124 model.

I think the key word is comfort level. I am a prospective buyer, and have no experience with a Trailmanor. I have pulled the same 17 foot boat about 3000 pounds across the Eastern hills with a 4 liter Ford Aerostar van, a 4.3 liter Chevy Astro van with tow package, and a 4.7 liter V8 5 speed auto Toyota 4Runner. All three went up all the hills and boat ramps. On hills where the two vans would be in third gear at high rpms at 50, the Toyota could do 75 or 80 in fouth or fifth gear. No, I don't normally drive that fast but that is another story. Here is where the comfort level comes in. In the West follow RockyMtnRay's advice. Altitude kills horsepower. He is a true expert IMHO. In the East I have simply slowed down, monitored cooling, traveled lighter, and used lower gearing to go where I wanted with the vans. My fun began when I got to the lake, not with the driving there. With the Toyota I am much more comfortable and confident. I really don't notice that much difference in towing like I did with the vans. To me it really comes down to "comfort level" and how fast you drive both up and DOWN the Eastern bumps once the TV is rated to tow 5000 pounds. Having said all this, when it came time to buy a new TV, I paid an extra $2000 to get the V8 and 5 speed transmission to increase my comfort level when I bought the Toyota. The Trailmanor dealer was probably correct in his statement, but to me he should definitely add some comments about comfort level. It then becomes an individual decision.

[RockyMtnRay]

Originally Posted by TakingTerns

You folks have me concerned again. I'm a prospective TM buyer, with a leased 2006 Jeep Liberty with almost three years left on the lease. It has a factory installed class III trailer package. GCWR is 10,150 (curb weight 4,033), max trailer weight 5,000, tongue load limit 750, but a wheelbase of 104. It has a 3.7L 6-cyl gas engine and an automatic transmission. We expect to use a TM to take our sea kayaks (on the Jeep's roof) mostly to Maryland's eastern shore, which is essentially flat. However, we live in Pennsylvania's Poconos. By Rocky Mountain standards the Poconos are bumps in the road. Out here we call them mountains anyway. Home is at 1,300 feet (see, bumps), but we have to climb to that over a relatively short drive. We may also want to take the TM and the kayaks to New York's Adirondacks or up to Maine.

We looked at a 2720 and a 3124 last week. The queen bed in the 2720 is kind of turning us against that. We're old enough to no longer sleep through the night, and one of us would have to climb over the other to get to the bathroom. The 3124's king bed would allow us to sleep in line with the hall, so we'd be less disruptive of each other. Naturally, the TM dealer told us that "whatever we're driving will pull whatever he's selling" and the Jeep would be fine with a 3124.

Not to impune the dealer's honesty, but you folks seem to bring out facts the dealer didn't. If we stay out of the Rockies will we enjoy towing a 3124 with a Jeep Liberty, or should we not buy a TM now and get a real tow vehicle three years from now and keep sleeping at the Hilton until then?

There are two concerns: Power and Stability.

Powerwise, the Liberty...without the 'yaks on the roof...would be adequate for even a 3124 on the relatively low altitudes/mostly flat terrain of the eastern seaboard region. With the 'yaks on the roof, all bets are off since you will have a lot of aerodynamic drag & turbulence. My guess is that if you have the 'yaks on the rack and a 3124 in tow, you'll have problems maintaining speeds anywhere close to the speed limit when climbing grades. Even on the eastern hills.

Stability is another issue. I don't recall many, maybe not any, folks who've towed a 3124 with the Liberty. However, I do recall one member (jbeletti) who posted quite a few times about towing a 3023 in the northern (and very flat) midwest...IL, WI, MI...with a Liberty. And then came a post that hinted at a scary tow due to strong crosswinds. And then his posts pretty much stopped. I just checked his user profile which lists a home page that prominently features a large 5th wheel being towed by a Dodge Ram Quad Cab. Apparently either the 3023 or Liberty, or combination thereof, was not adequate.

My experience in towing a 2720SL with a Cherokee...essentially the same ultra short wheelbase, moderate torque, etc. as a Liberty...is that it was just barely large enough to control a 2720. There were a couple of incidents involving hard braking where I felt the Cherokee was quite close to its ability to control my 2720. One in particular...on the way home on the last tow I did before I traded the Cherokee for my current TV (Toyota Tundra)...involved hard braking on a sharply crowned, but dry 2 lane highway. Only with a quick tug and firm grasp on the steering wheel was I able to keep the trailer from pushing the Cherokee right off the side of the road. If I'd been towing the four foot longer 3124 I really don't think I could have prevented the entire rig from going off the road. Although I did manage to maintain control and stay on the pavement, that incident was the final straw for me...I started looking for a replacement tow vehicle the very next week.